Just some theoretical comparisons on the 2 options Steve has suggested.
Samyang vs Redcat
5.75 arc secs / pixel Samyang vs 3.10 arc secs Redcat
Fov: 10.0° x 6.67° Samyang vs 5.38° x 3.60° Redcat
Theoretical integration times for same photon capture:
Samyang at f2. 8 - 60 seconds
Samyang at f3. 2 - 80 seconds
Redcat at f4. 9. - 180 seconds
Didn't consider Samyang being used at f2.
There are obviously practical considerations, flatness of field and star shapes, which would best be compared with a quick test using both on the same night. There may issues such as how frequently refocusing may be required which can only be determined longer term.
Upon first reading the thread I quickly made a choice, but after doing the math which I hope I got right, I'm equally happy with either. So whilst I sit happily on the fence I'll leave it up to everyone else who has an interest to make my mind up for me. One of the perks of being the first to reply.
Cheers,
Ray
Samyang vs Redcat
5.75 arc secs / pixel Samyang vs 3.10 arc secs Redcat
Fov: 10.0° x 6.67° Samyang vs 5.38° x 3.60° Redcat
Theoretical integration times for same photon capture:
Samyang at f2. 8 - 60 seconds
Samyang at f3. 2 - 80 seconds
Redcat at f4. 9. - 180 seconds
Didn't consider Samyang being used at f2.
There are obviously practical considerations, flatness of field and star shapes, which would best be compared with a quick test using both on the same night. There may issues such as how frequently refocusing may be required which can only be determined longer term.
Upon first reading the thread I quickly made a choice, but after doing the math which I hope I got right, I'm equally happy with either. So whilst I sit happily on the fence I'll leave it up to everyone else who has an interest to make my mind up for me. One of the perks of being the first to reply.
Cheers,
Ray
Ray
Roboscopes Guinea Pig
Just some theoretical comparisons on the 2 options Steve has suggested.
Samyang vs Redcat
5.75 arc secs / pixel Samyang vs 3.10 arc secs Redcat
Fov: 10.0° x 6.67° Samyang vs 5.38° x 3.60° Redcat
Theoretical integration times for same photon capture:
Samyang at f2. 8 - 60 seconds
Samyang at f3. 2 - 80 seconds
Redcat at f4. 9. - 180 seconds
Didn't consider Samyang being used at f2.
There are obviously practical considerations, flatness of field and star shapes, which would best be compared with a quick test using both on the same night. There may issues such as how frequently refocusing may be required which can only be determined longer term.
Upon first reading the thread I quickly made a choice, but after doing the math which I hope I got right, I'm equally happy with either. So whilst I sit happily on the fence I'll leave it up to everyone else who has an interest to make my mind up for me. One of the perks of being the first to reply.
Cheers,
Ray
Ray, thanks for that useful feedback, agreed with the samyang 135mm that it would need stopping down to F/3.2 to get the best out of the
stars
I am fairly easy with either scope to be fair as I have both on the shelf, however when I have finished building them I will be
conducting said test and will report back my findings, if the field is
flat enough then I personaly would lean towards the Samyang for its
extra FOV but for that reason only
Steve
PS which ever one it is, both will be using 3d printed adapters and a belt focuser but the Redcat will be using a deepsky dad version and the Samyang would be using the ZWO EAF
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
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Hello,
i would like to have the Samyang 135mm. Reason for that is there are very few systems of 135mm around the remote observatories around the world which offer the 135mm with 7 filters. With a zwo2600mm pro the stars at the corners shud be fine too for making wonderful widefield mosaics.... Hope this is going to be a hourly basis setup...
vikas
i would like to have the Samyang 135mm. Reason for that is there are very few systems of 135mm around the remote observatories around the world which offer the 135mm with 7 filters. With a zwo2600mm pro the stars at the corners shud be fine too for making wonderful widefield mosaics.... Hope this is going to be a hourly basis setup...
vikas
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Since we are using Sigma 105 Art for Pier 4, why not use the same lens for Pier 11 with something like 2600MM? Optically this is a better corrected lens than Samyang 135 (I owe both).
Or the Sigma 135 Art if we care about the 30% FOV differences.
We can also use the astromechanics EF autofocuser for AF and aperture control.
Or the Sigma 135 Art if we care about the 30% FOV differences.
We can also use the astromechanics EF autofocuser for AF and aperture control.
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correct me if i m wrong but the astromechanics will only work with OSC and not mono filter systems....vikas
correct me if i m wrong but the astromechanics will only work with OSC and not mono filter systems....vikas
my take on it is the new slimmed down 6200 adapter will work fine with the 2600 as well
none the less for the sake of completeness I have asked the question last night anyways
another 105 kind off makes sense as it means pier 4 OSC users could simply add HA to there data by supplementing it with pier 11
we will see what they say
steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
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why not have a 6200 on it - what a wide field that wud be and stunning mosaics if the edges can be managed on the 6200.....vikas
The issue as you pointed out is the edges and they scare me, plus I think the 2600 is a better sensor
none the less I am on the task with the 105 behind the scenes!
I hope you don’t mind me going if topic for a moment Vikas, can you check your coordinates for the vulture on P5 P8 please ?
I believe Phil may ask you as well but as we are talking I thought I would ask
steve
none the less I am on the task with the 105 behind the scenes!
I hope you don’t mind me going if topic for a moment Vikas, can you check your coordinates for the vulture on P5 P8 please ?
I believe Phil may ask you as well but as we are talking I thought I would ask
steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
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Darn, things are changing. My personal choice of focal length lies between the 135 and 250, so going below 135 is not what I was expecting.
Owned both Samyang 135 and Sigma 135 but used on different camera systems. Great fov on full frame and aps cameras, but the amount of zooming in required to view individual objects and then finding slightly mushy detail, put me off. Pier 4 is great but apart from some Ha I'm unsure what the same lens on pier 11 would bring. If you use 2 or 3 narrowband filters then a large part of the raison d'etre is portraying the gas composition, or in my case, creating a gaudy picture. There is surely a risk that the image scale would not delineate the colours clearly enough to make narrowband worthwhile, Ha excepted. Just my quarter of a cents worth. Now climbing back up on the fence.
Owned both Samyang 135 and Sigma 135 but used on different camera systems. Great fov on full frame and aps cameras, but the amount of zooming in required to view individual objects and then finding slightly mushy detail, put me off. Pier 4 is great but apart from some Ha I'm unsure what the same lens on pier 11 would bring. If you use 2 or 3 narrowband filters then a large part of the raison d'etre is portraying the gas composition, or in my case, creating a gaudy picture. There is surely a risk that the image scale would not delineate the colours clearly enough to make narrowband worthwhile, Ha excepted. Just my quarter of a cents worth. Now climbing back up on the fence.
Ray
Roboscopes Guinea Pig
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Hi, YESSS!!, a big mistake on the coordinates of the LBN777 Vulture Nebula both on Pier 5 and the Pier 8 order. The coordinates i entered were of M45 which showed up on the Telescopious right side bar while i shud have entered the co-ordinates on the bottom...... i think Pier5 is done while Pier 8 is pending?? Thanks for catching this .... my email is down for the next few days so how do i go about correcting this mistake
vikas
vikas
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Submitted a ticket of the incorrect coordinates of LBN777 vulture nebula. Sorry for going off topic .......back to Pier 11.... i feel 135mm and a zwo2600 wud be the correct solution. Mosaics on a 105mm with a 6200 wud be too difficult to stitch without a rotator in any case .....vikas
After much thought, research and bank balance checking for the new wide-field rig. I have opted in the end for a different route. Some of you may be please and some not so much but I am hoping it should work out to be the perfect FOV and have better resolution than the other options
Canon 200mm F/2.0 IS USM L Pro camera lens
Astromechanic new slimline focuser
ZWO 6200 MM Pro full frame camera
ZWO 7 position 2” filter wheel
Antlia LRGB HOS 2” 3nm filters
Steve
Canon 200mm F/2.0 IS USM L Pro camera lens
Astromechanic new slimline focuser
ZWO 6200 MM Pro full frame camera
ZWO 7 position 2” filter wheel
Antlia LRGB HOS 2” 3nm filters
Steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
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Steve,
Thanks for your thorough investigation into the options and the surprise near ultimate solution. A double thumbs-up from me. But aren't you a bit concerned though that this might make pier 4 redundant. 
Anyone interested in buying a second hand sigma lens?
Cheers,
Ray
Thanks for your thorough investigation into the options and the surprise
near ultimate solution. A double thumbs-up from me. But aren't you a bit concerned though that this might make pier 4 redundant. Anyone interested in buying a second hand sigma lens?
Cheers,
Ray
Ray
Roboscopes Guinea Pig
Steve,
Thanks for your thorough investigation into the options and the surprise
near ultimate solution. A double thumbs-up from me. But aren't you a bit
concerned though that this might make pier 4 redundant.
Anyone interested in buying a second hand sigma lens?
Cheers,
Ray
Honestly Ray, I think Pier 4 being OSC and wider FOV places it apart from this new
widefield, Some people just prefer OSC and if you look at some of the
images PIER-4 has produced it is most certainly not a compromise
The new one brings narrowband into the equation as well as LRGB imaging and
not everyone wants to do this. Not to mention they will have very
different prices points!
Whilst we are talking about price, should this new widefield rig be an Hourly or syndicate pier, I am
interested to get peoples thoughts
Steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
To be honest unless I am dissuaded otherwise by users preferences, I would prefer to keep both wide fields hourly as in general they are;
1, very popular
2, allow Roboscopes to keep a low entry price into remote imaging so all can enjoy
3, it means Roboscope's staff can also play with excess downtime on the pier and do some outrageous deep wide field and interesting shots
Lets see what other members have to say how ever
Steve
1, very popular
2, allow Roboscopes to keep a low entry price into remote imaging so all can enjoy
3, it means Roboscope's staff can also play with excess downtime on the pier and do some outrageous deep wide field and interesting shots
Lets see what other members have to say how ever
Steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
I agree hourly is the best.
I enjoyed the low price of Pier 4 and the FOV.
the new widefield will still be a reasonable price but obviously it’s a much larger investment in equipment for us so won’t be quite as reasonable as pier 4
I suspect around €12/14
cheers
steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
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BTW Antlia's 3nm filters still have halo problems.
Maybe we can use astrodon/chroma 3nm O3 and use Antlia for others.
Maybe we can use astrodon/chroma 3nm O3 and use Antlia for others.
BTW Antlia's 3nm filters still have halo problems.
Maybe we can use astrodon/chroma 3nm O3 and use Antlia for others.
We are using Antlia on Pier 3 with 0 halo's, none the less the new widefield will be set up and tested in the UK before being fitted in Spain so we will see if they have halo's beforehand
It needs 50mm unmounted filters so using Astrodon/Croma makes a big difference in setup costs, so fingers crossed on the Antlia filters being halo free lol
Steve
Please ignore my dylexia wherever possible, just be thankful I can control my Tourettes ;)
Things to do, so little time!
Steve
Roboscopes Tea Boy
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